Have you seen that sound?

Julien (nonoise.club): Have you seen that noise? Great question, right? Invisible paints like air pollution or noise pollution are difficult to communicate. You know it's noisy, but it's sometimes hard to identify where it comes from. It's to identify the right solution. Today in Fighting Noise, my guest is Thomas Rittenschober from Seven Bel an Austrian startup having a solution for that. Hi Thomas, nice to have you here.

Thomas Rittenschober: Hi Julian, nice to meet you, nice to have me on the podcast.

Julien (nonoise.club): That's really nice to be here live from Linz, guess. Thomas, first question. Why is it so difficult for a human ear, for a human brain to identify where a noise comes from?

Thomas Rittenschober: Okay, so we're getting right into the technical details of sound localization. Good with me. So the way humans identify where sound is coming from is essentially based on time differences between when a sound wave hits your left or right ear or the other way around. And the distance of our ears is essentially specifically tuned to human speech. So we are well at identifying where sound is coming from when people are talking or when we want to locate a high frequency sound. But when it really comes to identifying lower frequency sound events like sound emissions from plants or machines, these type of sound events are very difficult for humans to identify because you need you would need to have a much wider distance between your ears or microphones, so to say. And this is exactly where an acoustic camera comes in and why measurement instruments are far more capable than the human being in this case, in terms of exactly locating where a specific sound event is coming from.

Julien (nonoise.club): You're right, we are starting quite technical, so today will be an episode for engineers, I guess, but I think for everyone in manufacturing or real estate industry as well. But let's start with yourself. Can you introduce yourself, Thomas?

Thomas Rittenschober: First of all, thanks again for having me today. My name is Thomas Rittenschober. I'm the founder and general manager at Seven Bel. We are a manufacturer of high-performance acoustic cameras. These are measurement instruments that are specifically used by industry professionals, mostly engineers, technicians, used in the context of locating sound emissions from products and processes. and I found the

Julien (nonoise.club): We'll deep dive into this, but maybe starting with yourself. What's your journey? What's your why? We'll go deeper into the solution for sure, but understanding why did you develop that solution.

Thomas Rittenschober: We have to go back almost 15 to 20 years. After university I joined a research institute where I focused on reducing sound emissions from products and processes. Back then I've already started using quite elaborate or

Julien (nonoise.club): Why noise?

Thomas Rittenschober: quite expensive measurement instrumentation for gathering data around sound events, vibrations, etc. And that's actually a topic that I've really developed a passion for. So my background is actually in mechatronics. So I'm trying to design products in terms of mechanics and electronics. and also information technology. But then after that, after my study and when I focused on my PhD degree, I really dig deep into trying to understand how products and processes emit sound and what you can actually do in order to control that sound. And then this is where I first got in touch with these delicate measurement instruments called acoustic cameras. was actually the first stint of my professional career for about seven years where I where I essentially developed a high-performance solution for reducing sound emissions from products and processes. And then I headed on to more industrial applications. I joined a company, Electric, in their medical ultrasound business. So also there it was somewhat very similar what I did not in the audible range but in the non audible range, ultrasound range using pulsed ecosystems for essentially generating medical ultrasound images and beyond that I eventually decided to found my own company and get back to the audible frequency range again.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: I've somewhat screened the market, tried to understand what has happened since then, how have acoustic cameras evolved. What I identified was essentially that these products were somewhat still lab-based systems, expert systems. I thought that it might be worthwhile to try to understand what it takes. to make these measurement instruments or how to modify those systems to make them compatible with mainstream applications. Not only on the cost side, because these products are typically very expensive and are still very expensive, but how to make them essentially more compatible with mainstream applications in the industry. And that's what I've been doing for the last eight years now.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. to for the last eight years. So tell us about Seven Bel, a startup from Linz in Austria, where a lot of innovation is happening actually in Austria for the audience not being aware about the active Austrian market. Tell us about Seven Bel. You are developing a sound camera like this to localize sound in... every every space. Tell us bit more about that and maybe about the use cases behind you want to solve.

Thomas Rittenschober: Yeah, sure. So I founded the company in 2018 and it took us some three years to develop the technology. It all started out with, you know, trying to understand what it takes to build an acoustic camera with only a minimal set of microphones. So it was actually all based on the concept of frugal innovation, which essentially means I just give you a very scarce set of resources and your task to essentially achieve maximum performance with that and beating essentially the performance that is currently available or what is state-of-the-art. So this is actually how the whole challenge started in 2018. was quite tedious. took us some time to really figure out and get to the performance that was essentially at the level where we said, okay, now we are ready for the market. We obviously had the support from national funding agencies and also private investors, venture capitalists to make all of this happen because at some stage it's not only the concept that you want to implement, but there are lot of components both on the hardware side and software side to eventually create the product and also eventually also bring it into the market. And that was happening in 2021 when we eventually launched the product. And the areas where we initially focused on were building acoustics,

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: room acoustics and environmental noise. So our initial customers were mostly from the acoustic consultancy space. So experts that are confronted with acoustic challenges in their daily life, who obviously have expertise in the field of acoustics. But at some stage, know, when problems really become tricky, you want to rely and you don't want to rely on hypothesis only, you essentially resort to an acoustic camera and really kind of visualize what is happening and where the sound is coming from in order to make grounded engineering decisions thereafter.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. We'll add some pictures or video on this video podcast for the one watching the podcast on YouTube. We'll add some pictures to better understand the heat maps you do create with that camera. really, visualization of sound. You told me that a lot of, I think something like 70-80 % of projects are delayed because of any acoustic issues. in the So the pain is massive actually. It's not just of someone complaining about the sound but even in the preparation phase, in the building phase, it's a lot of delay and lot of cost of rework.

Thomas Rittenschober: . Especially when you approach the end of a construction project. People want to finish up the work and head on to the next project. In many cases the acoustic consultant comes in, measures sound transmission between rooms, tries to identify whether regulatory limits are met. then the negative news is coming in that certain rooms or certain the of the building are not up to the regulatory requirements. This is where people have to come in and need to the rework. As you can imagine, are many stakeholders in erecting a building. There many root causes that are on the table. That may be the eventual root cause that is responsible. for not meeting the requirement. And this is why an acoustic consultant needs to know exactly where that problem is sitting and who eventually to contact to fix the issue. Rather than going through a process of trial and error and let everyone come in and try to fix the situation, which obviously takes up a lot of resources, time and money.

Julien (nonoise.club): What you do develop is, we say, a sound camera or an acoustic camera. But if I get it right, it's more of an AI-powered microphone, which you can connect to the camera, even of your own tablet or of your own phone, right? So it's kind of low-asset. It's just a microphone. I know it's years of development, so just a microphone is maybe a bit tough. But it's only the microphone part. You do connect.

Thomas Rittenschober: Exactly.

Julien (nonoise.club): to a normal camera. Can you explain a bit about

Thomas Rittenschober: Exactly. Sure. So this is going back again to this concept of frugal innovation that essentially the question that we asked ourselves back then was what components are already available in the market that you can actually use or reuse for an acoustic camera. And what an acoustic camera essentially does is taking an image, recording a video, storing data. maybe sending data wirelessly from one point to another to get it processed. So a mobile device these days is essentially a commodity and it's a standard device that everyone has and that can be successfully reused for exactly that application. And on the other side of course we also wanted to reduce the engineering effort on our side, you know, to select the camera module, to do all of the video processing.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: all of that because it's available out of the box and you can reuse what's already available in the market. So the question more or less boiled down to having a microphone module only with a handful of microphones that is in the end it's a sensor stick you could call it that is rotating and scanning the sound field on a circular disc and that's actually like

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: That's like your minimum requirement that you have. You need to somewhat record the sound events. And as I said before in my introduction, cannot really, with an acoustic camera, you cannot only record those sound events with microphones that are only a few centimeters apart, but you need a much larger measurement surface that you need to cover. So that was actually the component that we developed. So a rotating microphone stick that is wirelessly sending or transmitting the data to a mobile device. And that mobile device eventually sends the data to the cloud for doing the number crunching work and for doing the heavy data processing. And eventually you get your data back from the cloud and do your analysis on these acoustic images.

Julien (nonoise.club): So this rotating stick is capturing sound reverbing against walls and materials and because you calculate how it rotates, where it comes from, you identify the exact source of a noise and you do some diagnostic based on, I guess, an AI-driven diagnostic to analyze this data and really mapping this on the picture you see on the camera.

Thomas Rittenschober: From a mathematics standpoint, it's you can imagine very involved to capture the audio data with moving microphones. So you have a lot of nasty effects included there with Doppler frequency shifts and so on and so forth, which you need to compensate for. But on the other hand, when you compare our product to traditional acoustic cameras, which are essentially based on on a wealth or host of dozens of microphones that are sitting stationary on a measurement surface. We have the advantage of moving microphones, meaning that we can capture the sound field at very many locations. So this is a key ingredient to getting high quality acoustic images, because what you eventually want to do is, as I said before, want to capture the sound field at very diverse locations. which are far apart and also at very many positions. So these are really the two ingredients that you need in order to get up or achieve acoustic images with high quality. This is essentially how our system works. So you have a stick that can range from a length of maybe 25 centimeters up to one and a half meters. So you can also capture

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: very large measurement surface having a diameter of more than two and a half meters where you can really go down to the very low frequencies and at the same time you can capture that sound field with only a handful of microphones since those microphones are moving and capturing the sound field at very very many locations.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. As an investor, I love asking the same question every time, why now? Why is it the right moment? Why such a solution doesn't exist or didn't exist before? Is it thanks to the AI part of its algorithm you've built behind the sensibility of the camera, of the microphone? Why is it a perfect momentum for you to develop 7-Bell?

Thomas Rittenschober: Yeah, so there were a lot of technological parts and pieces falling into place. The first thing was certainly the advent of mobile device technology. Prior to 2010, I think, and even 2015, it would have been very difficult to even think about or develop that solution because mobile devices were not that...

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: widely available with that level of performance that is required today. You would like to have a very nice high resolution camera, you would like to have a video camera with a high frame rate. You also kind of acquire multi-channel audio data at very high data rates using a wireless connection. And at the same time there was also a lot of progress on the microphone side. also, again, with the advent of mobile device technologies, microphones have been miniaturized. They became very small with also very good performance. So it was eventually possible to build up such systems at acceptable cost. And the other technological piece that also came around at this particular point in time, so it was at around 2015, was cloud computing eventually. Traditional acoustic cameras still use what is called ASIC technology, so these are dedicated application-specific integrated circuits that do the number crunching work. These are typically processors.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: that you have to develop in a multi-million euro project in order to eventually come up with such a solution. what we did is we sent that data that we acquired with only a handful of microphones, we sent that minimal set of data to the cloud, to the number crunching work in the cloud on high-performance computers and leveraged that architecture. So to sum it up, there were like...

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: many things on the software and hardware side falling in place, you know, with the advent of mobile device technology, with the advent of miniaturized microphones and also with the advent of cloud computing that eventually helped us or eventually made the implementation of that concept possible.

Julien (nonoise.club): That's great. Tell me Thomas, what the level of precision, sensitivity of such a solution, you're able to identify to localize sound or noise in a room, in an office for instance, you said that in any building. Are you able to identify what... piece of an engine is noisy or what piece of a watch is noisy. How small can the analysis be in reality?

Thomas Rittenschober: So let's take a standard example from the automotive industry. So now with e-mobility coming up, there's obviously a lot of analysis happening around e-power trains, so electric drives and motors and associated gearboxes. So let's say you have an object, maybe

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: length of 50 centimeters or so and if you have a specific sound emission, annoying sound emission from that part at around a couple of hundred hertz or maybe one kilohertz the blob or the size of the source that you can potentially locate is only a couple of centimeters so you can really specifically pinpoint to what the actual root cause of the sound emission is. When you develop a gearbox or an engine, the later stages of the project, engineers also develop special acoustic packages or solutions to kind of dampen the sound emissions from the product. So they need to understand where to specifically apply absorbing material.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: You want to this in a manner not to totally destroy the thermal management of the entire system. Because if you surround or put absorbing material all around your gearbox and your eDrive or your engine, the thermal management may be totally out of balance and the whole thing may be getting too hot and not meet the performance that it's required to do. So in this case it's very important for engineers to understand where to specifically place that material very effectively with little surface only and this is exactly where an acoustic camera helps because it clearly pinpoints where those sound emissions are happening and you can think of it like a band aid that you would then just apply to where the product is emitting sound and while still maintaining the thermal management household.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. at the right place. Last question Thomas for that run of Q &A. I think you already have more than 200 customers, great growth, but what's on your roadmap for the next years? What in terms of product development, what do you want to go into next years?

Thomas Rittenschober: We have lot of ideas in our funnel. What we see a lot happening these days is that engineers and technicians want to work very effectively. They don't want to necessarily waste their time with analyzing data in great detail and pushing lot of buttons and looking at lot of diagrams. So this is actually where AI and analysis of the data is coming in. So we want to support our customers on this path to eventually show them the data that is relevant so that they can make grounded decisions on grounded technical decisions on their end. Because you also see it in your daily life. Things are getting faster. Nowadays, most people are already working with JetGPT in their daily lives. Things that typically consumed maybe 15, 30 minutes, one hour or even more in the past can now be done within a couple of minutes with the support of these tools. This is actually the direction that we are also going. We don't want our customers to waste their time with raw data and a lot of diagrams and digging into the nitty-gritty. In the end they are interested in solutions and how to fix their issues. An acoustic camera in the end is a troubleshooting tool. It should help you in getting to your final conclusions and final measures quickly. This is where we are putting a lot of effort into. to try to understand how we can abstract the complexity of the data that an acoustic camera produces, to abstract that flood of data away from the end user and support him in trying to understand what's going on and how he can make those decisions more quickly. At the same time, of course, this is on the product side. At the same time, we're focusing on specific industries.

Julien (nonoise.club): You should.

Thomas Rittenschober: where we see a very good traction of our product, which is certainly the automotive industry, but also the construction industry.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. Okay, yeah, it generates a lot of questions, but let's switch to the discussion round to keep a short podcast episode today. Thomas Hedenschaber from 7Bells, thanks a lot for your first answers and we'll switch now to the discussion part.

Thomas Rittenschober: Thanks for

Julien (nonoise.club): Thanks a lot Thomas for your first answers. As I said at the end of the Q &A part, it generates a lot of questions to me. My feeling is that even with great technology, we still need to convince people to use more and more that kind of technology to identify noise and to fight against noise. The feeling is you make it more available, at least in terms of speed. It's quite fast to analyze sound. It has to fit the economic equation of the construction company, of the manufacturing company, that they really work on it and find the right solution. And I think it really helps. So is it... Is the awareness good enough? You would tell me it's never good enough, but do you think it's only a question of awareness that... industrial companies better solve noise issues? It's just a question of awareness or do we still need to go further in terms of technology?

Thomas Rittenschober: Yes, that's certainly a good question. To some extent, you know, see over the last couple of decades a lot of pressure building up on the regulatory side. mean, manufacturers of products need to meet certain noise regulations, maybe for vehicles, for construction equipment, also, you know, inside a building for the well-being of people.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: there are regulations available. And you know when this pressure is building up and you see it currently with EV vehicles coming up that the noise emission thresholds are kind of being lowered.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: fueled of course by the introduction of new technologies. But it's still challenging of course then for manufacturers to meet these requirements. And this is exactly why they need the instrumentation, why they need measurement instruments. Because as a human being it's very difficult to understand when you are kind of over that limit to know where that sound is exactly coming from. what you need to do about it. So this is one side of the story.

Julien (nonoise.club): Yeah, fighting in fighting invisible noise is quite frustrating for lot of even of professionals. You're like frustrated not to identify what is the best way is the best way to do it. And again, I'm not sure it's solved by the economic equation of of such companies. Just a point about the mobility part, because you say that it's something I hear a lot. I discard that point in other podcasts, too. But

Thomas Rittenschober: Yeah.

Julien (nonoise.club): electric vehicles or electric motors for EV vehicles is not solving the mobility noise problem we have because the engines before were already in the right norm so sure we can reduce kind of a white noise kind of a background noise but in terms of damaging noises or harmful noises, most of this noise comes from the contact between the wheel and the road, or brakes or other pieces of mobility and not the engine itself. And a lot of people think we will reach our European target of reducing noise emission in mobility by 30 % until 2030. The fact is, for now, we

Thomas Rittenschober: Mm-hmm.

Julien (nonoise.club): the most optimistic cases will reach something like 15 to 19 percent of reduction if electric vehicles are really raising the weight was in the last years. 2025 is a bit worse but in the last years. So I think we still have a lot to do. Just taking that part because I think a lot of efforts are not made because people think it will be automatically through electric vehicles and it's not the case so we still need to find other solutions. Part closed. But you know my first reaction as I heard about you as we met the first time it was the market is not big enough for the market specific market is not big enough but when you see the cause only for construction and real estate and you spoke about automotive and engine the market is huge because it's

Thomas Rittenschober: Huh?

Julien (nonoise.club): It's a daily issue of so many companies and rework is just causing a lot of money. that's really my, I can't understand why it's not used by, like every construction company in every part of the solution. No, sorry, running.

Thomas Rittenschober: Yep. I mean that pressure is actually a process in the end and we are kind of observing the process and we see that the pressure is building up. I will talk about the construction industry maybe a little bit and also automotive industry but what we see on the product development side and that's not only cars but also other types of products, maybe lawn mowers, power tools etc. What you see happening there that it's

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: no longer not only the responsibility of the manufacturer of the product but that responsibility is also trickling down now to suppliers. In a sense you know that when a new product is being developed that for many years and decades you know acoustic requirements have not really been passed on that well to suppliers and suppliers of components to the final product. because it was more regarded as a final responsibility of the manufacturer to integrate everything. Looked at essentially try to understand that the coupling between all of these components is understood and that the final product meets the requirements and is as pleasant as possible. But we see this, we see a big change in this area happening now. Coming from the fact, you know, that these noise levels are being constantly pushed down. to a lower limit and that makes it very hard for engineers at the integration level to meet these requirements. And this is exactly where these responsibilities in the form of requirements are now also being forwarded or being trickled down to the suppliers. And this actually, of course, widens up the market for this type of measurement instruments, which is good. But coming back to your question about awareness, this is exactly what is now happening in many industries, that suppliers of components who previously just were responsible for the function of the component itself, meeting traditional performance parameters, now also have to worry about the acoustic performance, meaning that this

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. Imperations.

Thomas Rittenschober: components per se have to meet certain requirements at the component level to be sure that there is enough margin at the integration level when all of the multiple components are stick together and that the final sound emission is being met.

Julien (nonoise.club): I fully agree with that. I started deep diving on nonoise and better understanding what noise is or it disturbs us finally, I've been on a construction site and I try to understand what piece of noise is disturbing the area, residential area. And then I spoke to acousticians and I discovered that the full value chain of developing an engine, each piece of this engine putting it in a heavy vehicle and the full chain until the resident, until the habitat which is disturbed by the noise. It's I think something like 8 to 12 different stakeholders having to take the right decision in terms of capturing sound and of stopping sound. making it available for each stakeholders and putting even some responsibility at supplier level is in my opinion for sure helpful because if you have 12 different stakeholders what's happening mostly is that's not my part that's just because my supplier didn't provide the right solution. Is everyone responsible for that with regulation but I think with market pressure more marginal for sure it should help. Just a word about cities. see In many cities, noise is a big issue and localizing noise is a big issue as well. The city of Paris, the regional association Brouillep-Arif, developed their own acoustic camera to identify where noise is coming from at a corner. Is it a market for you, cities, as well? Are you able to cover that market? And more generally... Why don't you put your solution in Paris or maybe you have your solution in Vienna? I don't know. In Vienna, what about the B2G market?

Thomas Rittenschober: The nice thing about being a manufacturer of an acoustic camera is that you have such a wide field of where it can be actually used. But from a business standpoint it's at the same time very difficult to focus on the areas where you sense or feel most resonance from customers eventually. Having said that, we know that there are manufacturers of acoustic cameras out there focusing on these kind of infrastructure projects. It's a of monitoring application where you put acoustic camera modules in certain locations and observe what's happening over time.

Julien (nonoise.club): Yeah.

Thomas Rittenschober: And this is an area where we could potentially enter because we have all of the ingredients technology-wise, but at the same time you need to focus.

Julien (nonoise.club): Okay, so the go-to market is expensive.

Thomas Rittenschober: Yes, the product as we have it today and we want to make it fit for that application. Certainly some effort is required. It's not only about smart cities, you could also think about end of line quality control, could think about automated maintenance of components. There are lot of applications for an acoustic camera out there. We try to find our sweet spot, where we think there is a big enough market and where we also have a competitive edge over our competitors.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. and focus on your most evident go-to-market sets, that's for sure. So I fully understand that. Founders need to focus. I've been there, I'm still there. So I understand that point. I have two last questions before letting you leave and meet further customers. Ultrasound. Ultrasound is not a noise itself. It's really hard to identify a... to identify, to capture an ultrasound, at least for normal microphones. If you hear some ultrasound, it's disturbing you, take your iPhone and you won't be able to measure anything. In terms of decibels, it's quite low, still very disturbing. Are you able to measure that?

Thomas Rittenschober: We have a sensor solution that also measures in the ultrasound domain. It's specifically used for locating compressed air leaks and partial discharge. So these are two types of sound events that are relevant to the industry. So when you have a production plant, compressed air... is a medium that is used for operating a lot of and actuating a lot of machinery. And if you have leaks in there it's like having your window open during winter time. So you're losing a lot of energy and wasting a lot of energy. So companies are really starting to focus on that a lot in terms of using acoustic cameras for locating.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: compressed air leaks, fixing those issues and reducing energy consumption over time. It's really impressive when we do some of these measurement services ourselves and we have a customer base using our equipment for locating compressed air leaks in their production plants. Since our system is modular, It can be both used in the audible range for occupational health and safety, for evaluating noise at the workstation or at the workplace. But the same time you just swap the sensor module and you can do the same measurements in the ultrasound domain. When you walk through a medium-sized production plan you can easily find some 10 to 50,000 euros per year that you can save by just fixing those leaks. So it's really amazing.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm. It's great to hear that in terms of technology, we are at some place we can solve a lot of issues. I end this episode with a last question about technology. Do you think at some point we'll be able to measure everything with something like that? Not using big microphones is maybe not for you the right market. If you tell me we will be able to replace a microphone, but the question is more, are we able to make some Portative solution at some point and make it really available for everyone quite easily because it's still a project to measure the way you do offer. It's high end, I understand that, it's way simpler than before. Still, it's not everyone, every consumer is able to use such a solution. So do you think at some point we make it portable, really portable?

Thomas Rittenschober: Thank Hmm. I think so. It depends on what applications you want to cover. As I said in my introduction, the challenge is what noise sources you would like to locate. In many cases we feel annoyed not really by the medium to high frequency sound sources but by the rather low frequency sound sources. fans from heat pumps, traffic noise etc. And in this particular case you just need to solve the problem of how you can capture the sound field with microphones being very far apart. if the technology is not going into the direction of making mobile devices even larger then that's the thing that needs to be solved.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: Looking into the future, I'm always optimistic and I think that miniaturization will happen at some stage. And we also see it already happening in our industry. We have applications like the one with locating compressed air leaks, for instance, where the sound events are happening in the ultrasound domain. You can already use very compact systems that you could even integrate into a mobile device at some stage.

Julien (nonoise.club): Mm-hmm.

Thomas Rittenschober: with all the software, with all the hardware, etc. to do the job. I certainly see this coming over time, maybe not for the full range of applications and sound events that we want to locate, but maybe for some.

Julien (nonoise.club): you Thomas Rittenschober, founder and CEO of Seven Bel, Seven Bel.com, S-E-V-E-N-B-E-L.com, one L only. If you want to have more information about Seven Bel. Great starter actually. We didn't speak too much about figures, but more than 200 customers. You told me you have a gross weight almost at 70 % per year, which is kind of impressive as well. I think the first is nice when I feel that technology is meeting the need we have in a lot of industries and I think it's really important to measure it right if we want to solve the noise issue we have to fight against noise. Thomas, thanks a lot for your time today it was a pleasure to have you and let us know what are the next steps of Seven Bel at nonoise we'll be really happy to... to make some noise about it.

Thomas Rittenschober: Thanks again very much for having me on the podcast. was really great talking to you.

Julien (nonoise.club): See you soon and bye, bye everyone. Thanks for listening to this episode and don't hesitate to share it with your community. If you think it can be interesting for someone, just do that and give us please, if you like this episode, five stars on your favorite broadcasting platform. It will help a lot to, as I said, by joke, make some noise about and make some noise about fighting noise because I think it's a question of community. Thanks everyone and see you soon.